Apple rejecting non-interactive book apps

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Apple rejecting non-interactive book apps

(27 posts) (13 voices)

Started 2 years ago by Dragyn
Latest reply from Shibbs

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Dragyn
Moderator

I recently submitted a "book app" to the App Store, and it was rejected. Of course, I appealed, and they called today to discuss it.

To be clear, this was a simple book app. Full scans of all pages, pinch-zoom support, background music, page flips with sound, etc. But no real moving parts - it was a reading experience only. Apparently pinch-zooming doesn't qualify as "interactive" anymore.

The manager who called told me in no uncertain terms that they will not approve any books that could possibly be released under the iBookstore. When I brought up the thousands of similar reading apps out there, he said that the "App Store is evolving", and that moving those Apps into iBookstore books will "be discussed with the developers" when they submit updates. So if the book was up before the iBookstore, it's safe for now. If it's new, then the answer is no. He did encourage the reformatting of the book to submit to the iBookstore, which I'll have to take a look at doing, although I understand you must have an ISBN, and those aren't cheap to register ($125 each, from what found).

Obviously, this rejection is only for books you "only" read, as opposed to the fully interactive book apps (like Alice and the Three Little Pigs popup book).

I thought I'd share this to save others the time of building a "traditional" book app only to get it rejected. Still, all coding is good practice, right?

(I will footnote that the guy who called me was very friendly and pleasant, and was very willing to discuss the issue in detail. Kudos to Apple for having real humans calling, not scripted drones.)

Posted 2 years ago #
Benihana
Member

It's a shame Apple still can't stick to a published list of guidelines. I realize we aren't owed anything, but I think it's a reasonable expectation to have a good idea of what they will and won't approve, so that we don't waste time developing something which won't be. The App Store Review Guidelines were released under the guise of satisfying that, however I can't find any guidelines which apply to your situation.

Edit: Except the "Living document" guideline at the end, which essentially says "we can do whatever we want."

Posted 2 years ago #
Dragyn
Moderator

Originally I thought they were rejecting based on religious content ("A Morning Prayer" by Robert Louis Stevenson), but that wasn't the case.

I believe it was rejected under 10.1 "Apps that look similar to apps bundled on the iPhone, including the App Store, iTunes Store, and iBookstore, will be rejected".

Since it was a book reading thing (could be seen as similar to iBookstore), it was rejected. Of course, I didn't bother to bring up "Google Books" or "Kindle Reader" apps, since obviously they are there to grab "crossover" users from other platforms.

I am considering releasing the source code (without the images), if anyone is interested. I mean, really, I know for a fact that any derivative products of my code won't be competing with my app now...

Posted 2 years ago #
abitofcode
Administrator

Not great news. I'm half way through a portfolio piece containing zoomable art in a coffee table styley.

Look like I'll have to add some particle effects :S

Posted 2 years ago #
slycrel
Member

That is unfortunate. Especially after all that hard work! I wish apple were more transparent about their current process in the grey areas. It's not surprising that they chose to go this direction, though it is surprising to me that they've not said anything publicly about it. At least to the developers. There are a ton of book apps on the store, you'd think they would be more clear.

For purely selfish reasons I'd love to see your code. =) I've almost done a book app a couple of times.

Though maybe this is good news in disguise -- could apple be adding support for these kinds of features (i.e. background music, etc) in their iBooks app?

Posted 2 years ago #
Dragyn
Moderator

@slycrel: It's funny you say that. When the Apple rep said that it would have to be a "rich media" book app to be accepted, I did say - "My book does have background music", and he said something to the effect that iBookstore can support music. I had never heard that, but I haven't spent too much time outside of cocos-land lately.

I'm still considering my options with my book code. I hate to sound miserly, but after so much coding time (100+ hours of coding and testing), I'm still trying to figure out if I can monetize what I've built.

Posted 2 years ago #
TBBle
Moderator

@Dragyn: Did it look like Books? That clause (10.2) is about appearance, not functionality. I'd say 2.11 is the clause you fell under, if any.

10.2 is "Apps that look similar to apps bundled on the iPhone, including the App Store, iTunes Store, and iBookstore, will be rejected"
2.11 is "Apps that duplicate apps already in the App Store may be rejected, particularly if there are many of them"

Posted 2 years ago #
Dragyn
Moderator

@TBBle: Nope, didn't look like iBooks at all, except that it was...a book. Basic UI was a main menu overlaid over the cover of the book, and then browsing through swipes or taps, pinch zoom, and a HUD that would fly in from the top and bottom.

The guy from Apple specifically told me that since the book could be put into the iBookstore without loss of content, that's why they wouldn't approve it.

Still, water under the bridge at this point, I guess. One positive note is that what is published through the iBookstore is NOT vetted for content, so there should be no content-hoops to jump through.

Any other devs here actually publish an iBookstore book through Apple? Would love to hear any advice / horror stories.

Posted 2 years ago #
Nico...
Member

Well I'm not really surprised by their reaction.
Just because you wrote an app doesn't make it an interactive
book, since all it does is show text with a HUD and lets you
change pages like iBooks does...

Posted 2 years ago #
Dragyn
Moderator

@Nico...: It depends on your definition of "interactive". I mean, it really is something you "interact" with.

The aspect that bugs me is that they changed their criteria to disallow this type of app, when there are THOUSANDS of them currently for sale. And by their own admission, they are not kicking them out of the app store - they'll wait until the dev submits a new version, and then "have this discussion". So thousands of them are in & safe, and new submissions are rejected.

I have also looked more at the iBookstore. Submitting directly requires an ISBN, which is $125 to register ONE ISBN. Going through a third party submission service, many of whom will assign the ISBN for you at little or no cost, will take some of your profit, but most of them won't touch public domain works, like mine. So it's $125 to get it ready to submit, with no way to really get much exposure for it. Still can't decide if it's worth it or not.

Posted 2 years ago #
Nico...
Member

@Dragyn Yeah I understand the frustration when the rules change under your feet.
$125 isn't much. You're using some existing material for the text (if I understand right),
imagine if you had to pay a writer, or write it yourself, it would have cost much more than that !
TANSTAFL as we usually say...

Posted 2 years ago #
d-range
Member

I have mixed thoughts on this one. On the one hand I can understand that it is extremely frustrating if you invested all this time and your book app got rejected, and maybe even more frustrating that the submission guidelines are sometimes unclear or can be changed by apple without notice, which effectively means you risk investing time in a moving target. On the other hand, I think that in almost all the rejected application stories I've seen Apples position was has been very defendable. Either the developer willingly broke the App Store guidelines, or the app that was rejected was actually extremely crappy, trivial or superfluous. Your book application is a little less obvious example, but I think you could have seen this coming. It has been clear from the start that Apple does't want applications that just reformat existing content into an app, which is why they banned apps that just opened a website or reformatted an RSS feed, almost right from the beginning. A book app that doesn't do anything that iBooks already does is along the same lines, if they allowed that, the app store would soon be overrun by developers who just rehashed the same application over and over for different books (which was actually what was happening until Apple actively started rejecting them).

So while I do feel bad for you that you put in all this effort and didn't get your work in the App Store, the conclusion I'll draw from your warning to other developers is that people should think their projects through very well before spending hundreds of hours on them, and try to think a bit like Apple about the way the App Store was intended in the first place: for applications, not just as a different way to see the same content available elsewhere, with no additional functionality.

Posted 2 years ago #
Dragyn
Moderator

My first test on a new idea, especially something like this, is to review what is in the App Store already. I did this. And there are thousands of readers. Not to mention Google Books and the Kindle reader. There is a massive number of these in the store. They have never stated that they have changed their policy on these. A single line in the Review Guidelines identifying this split in the books would have been helpful.

@d-range: I did a lot more than simply display a series of images. It depends on how you define "additional functionality". Background music, page turn effects & sound, pinch-zoom, smoothly hiding top and bottom HUDs, I would consider these all "additional functionality" beyond just content.

Still, that's why forum like this can be helpful, so we can share our experiences so others can learn from them.

My app itself performs extremely well, and provides a nice reading experience, so I can't be too upset - I created another nicely polished project, and I learned some things along the way.

I'm still trying to find a creative way to make it interactive - not sure how a book of prayers written by Robert Louis Stevenson over a hundred years ago could be made "interactive" by Apple's definition. Maybe jigsaw puzzles to put the pages together? Rewrite them all as rebuses, so you have to decode before you see the original text? Reveal in a match game? And every one of those ideas would be accepted by Apple, since it would be interactive, even if it was a little strange & odd.

Posted 2 years ago #
d-range
Member

Yes, I agree it's a bit of a grey area where 'reformatted content' ends and 'interactive content' starts. Maybe you could add something along the lines of displaying a random prayer every day, lookup specific prayers for specific topics, add cross-references or links to web content, etc? In other words try to increase the value of the content for readers who are interested in it, so they can learn more from it than just what is in the text?

Just checking what's already in the app store is not a good idea, but you already found that out. The App Store rules have changed a few times, but Apple almost never retroactively pulls apps that were rightfully accepted under the previous policy. So even though you can be pretty sure a fart app won't be allowed anymore, there are still plenty left that were submitted just after the app store was launched.

Posted 2 years ago #
jblaven
Member

Sorry to hear it. I am glad you shared, because I might have fallen into the same issue. I want to include some interactive parts, just have to decide where.

Posted 2 years ago #
Nico...
Member

Dragyn said "And there are thousands of readers" ...
Maybe this should be a wakeup call...
Ask yourself : what will I bring that really justifies writing the 1000++th
app on the same theme ?

Posted 2 years ago #
varedis
Moderator

My very first app before discovering cocos2d was an epub reader, I had the idea of trying to get publishers on board and do a main portal from where they could sell their books, but then the iBooks store came around and the project never got off the ground.

I finished all the code and the app worked perfectly, in app purchases for books etc.

However it was a great learning experience and even though I didnt make any money from it I felt a sense of accomplisment knowing that I had done what a lot of people at the time were having a hard time doing.

An old video of the app, a lot more went in to it after this video was shot:

http://screencast.com/t/NTY1NWI5M

Posted 2 years ago #
Dragyn
Moderator

@varedis: Nice video. I particularly enjoyed your choice of using Pratchett for your sample. Definitely one of the masters of his craft.

@Nico...: Wow. Describing a different book reader as an "app with the same theme" makes me think you probably don't read a lot of books. Most of the readers on the App Store are single-title apps. Different content = different book. "Same theme" doesn't enter into the consideration with books.

Posted 2 years ago #
TBBle
Moderator

As d-range has indicated, Apple's guidelines indicate that "what's in the App Store already" isn't a strong criteria for "what's allowed" but is in fact a consideration for "what's not allowed". They've been pretty consistent in "if you're in, you're OK, but that doesn't mean we have to keep letting everyone in" as the rules for the App Store change.

"Background music, page turn effects & sound, pinch-zoom, smoothly hiding top and bottom HUDs" apart from background music, Kobo reader does all these to PDF files, let alone properly formatted ebooks. And it might very well do background music, I don't know.

Posted 2 years ago #
javy
Member

Thank you Dragyn for this post. I'm currently making an eBook for a client now, and it's good to know this before sending it off and getting a rejection letter.

Thankfully, my client already has an ISBN, so it shouldn't be too much trouble to submit.

Posted 2 years ago #
javy
Member

Where can I find information relating to publishing through iBooks instead of apps?

Posted 2 years ago #
Dragyn
Moderator

You apparently start at http://itunes.com/sellyourbooks

I haven't found much documentation other than that interface.

If you want to look at the third party aggregators, they have a whole link one page in (select "Books", continue, and there's a link at the bottom to their official page of sanctioned aggregators)

Posted 2 years ago #
thesanch
Member

Just to join in the discussion, I recently had my ebook application rejected, receiving this:
"We've completed the review of your app, however, we cannot post this version to the App Store because the primary purpose of your app is to display content that is a book. Such content is more appropriate for iBookstore."

I thought perhaps it is too similar to the iBooks platform falling under 2.11,10.2. I have adjusted my display, but I am thinking now I need more features (adding rich media) to make it unique to the market. I have spent over 100 hours on this project as well. Its nice to see some more information regarding this issue.

Posted 2 years ago #
Dragyn
Moderator

In case anyone reading this is interested, the source code for my Book Reader app is available (for a modest price) as a "starting point" for anyone wanting to develop it into a more Apple-friendly / interactive app.

Details can be found in this post.

Posted 2 years ago #
PaulCentaur
Member

@javy - electronic books should have different ISBNs to print versions, just like the hardback and paperback have different ISBNs.

An app does not need an ISBN because it's not a book.

Bear in mind that iBooks also have a review process which takes a rather long time and then can reject a book without specifying the reason (you have to then ask!).

I've recently been involved in publishing some small cookbooks as apps. They have some lovely full-width photographs and each page is a recipe, so are arguably less "bookish", even though the titles are available via Kindle and other sources as an eBook. It may help that it is original copyright content rather than a public domain title.

The secpnd app was rejected for not allowing rotation on iPad, even though the first (approved) app had the same limitation. I recently resubmitted it (with full rotation and iPhone support) and it was approved. I'll have to try submitting another title to see if we fall foul of the new ruling.

There are still many things that can be done better in an app than in the Enhanced iBooks spec, but ironically one of the things you can do with Enhanced iBooks is stop users rotating the book!

Posted 2 years ago #
Shibbs
Member

(Quite old topic to post, but still posting) Lately, we too ran into this whole 'book app' rejection stuff.

However, we have appealed providing our rationale, why we think otherwise:

It's more than a Book. Here are the reasons why we think so:
1) Each day's prayer has a saints pic with it.
2) App auto selects the prayer for each day of the month for the user.
3) Unique Horizontal Carousel menu (inspired by Openflow) with saint pics for visual appeal.
4) Nice tween animation for content switching between each prayer.
5) Pinch to zoom in & out for font size, and the user settings gets persisted by the app.

Moreover, there's no equivalent of the app in the print media(book) format.

We await for their response.

Posted 8 months ago #
Shibbs
Member

Apple guys replied, they don't buy our (mentioned above) argument:

Sep 14, 2012 07:05 PM. From Apple.

Thank you for your response. It would be appropriate to provide additional functionality to differentiate your app further from an ebook-like experience to be suitable for the App Store.

Posted 8 months ago #

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